In “What Makes a Good Player into a Star” I listed what makes a player into a star and one of the comments I made was that
….Potential does not equal stardom…. they all had talent but like we have discussed in this article. Talent means nothing. You still have to work hard….
Gary Ablett snr is a legend but would he get a game in Todays Sanitized Game?
Deano blasted my comment of “talent means nothing” and used Gary Ablett snr as a perfect example.
Gary Ablett Snr was widely renowned as the worst trainer at the club and was terrible during pre season yet was arguably the greatest and most exciting footballer of all time. Shane Warne ate baked beans, smoked cigarettes, drank beer and shagged different women every day yet still managed to be the greatest bowler of all.
Deano makes a brilliant observation and from that I must ask, Would Gary Ablett snr get a game with his attitude in todays sanitized AFL?
I personally would have to say NO, Gary Ablett snr would not get a game because:
- He would not be fit enough with poor performance in pre season
- Poor training
- Lack of team work
- No AFL club would risk his antics, attitude etc
Interestingly, I remember hearing an interview from Allan ‘Yabby’ Jeans the Hawthorns coach in the 80′s when asked if he regretted letting Gary Ablett snr go from Hawthorn in 1982 and if he would have won more Premierships. His reply further backs up why Gary Ablett would NOT get a game in todays AFL.
No, If Gary Ablett snr still played for Hawthorn we would NOT have any Premierships because of his attitude and lack of team play, it poisons a team! A Premiership team should not rely on one player.
Yabby Jeans then used Geelong’s poor Grand Final performances in the late 80s and 90s for proof on his reply.
Give us your Opinion on if Gary Ablett snr would get a game in Todays AFL
So what do you think? Do you think a talented player like Gary Ablett snr who sucks at training, may eat the wrong foods, may not be the best team mate and a bit of an eccentric get a game in todays AFL? Another question could be following the National draft, do the AFL clubs look for footballers like Ablett snr or rather prefer athletes like Nit Nat and Jack Watts?
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January 21st, 2009 at 8:58 pm
Well, there are exceptions: Jared Brennan for one. I don’t know what his track work or team ethic are like, but he certainly seems to be eccentric in his footy!
An 80s Ablett in today’s environment? 50/50. Gary Jr (and Nathan?) may suggest an even-money bet for a 00s Ablett Snr as well.
As I’ve suggested on the other post, the recruiting pendulum swings. In general, I think a bloke who can play footy and run a bit has probably got a better chance of a career at senior AFL level than an athlete who plays footy.
aussierulesblogs last blog post..Rags to riches. . .
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January 22nd, 2009 at 8:31 am
I think if you look at the 2008 National Draft you have a pure footballer being over looked for an athlete in Nit Nat going at pick 2 and Daniel Rich at pick 7. Also there are more than ever Irish and other country (Fiji, Canada) players being added to clubs lists, these people are not natural footballers…
Nathan Ablett is very similar as his old man – heaps of talent but did not want to do the hard work and Geelong gave him a year (mainly because of his name imo) but with the lists smaller than the 80s I do not think you can carry disillusioned players any more.
However Brennan is a good example and maybe even Hooper but they do not get an arm chair ride like G Ablett snr did.
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January 27th, 2009 at 7:36 am
Allow me to give you an example of why Ablett Snr would get a game today:
Nick Davis
Hasn’t got a quarter of the talent of Ablett, has no work ethic to speak of, and yet has survived up until recently in (arguably) the most ruthless team in the AFL.
There’s no doubt he’d get recruited – some teams back themselves to sort out players with issues, and all you can really go off at a young age is talent. And there’s a big chance that with the way the system works these days, he might never have had the same problems he did all along.
Talent still gets picked, it just doesn’t get made captain.
Geoffs last blog post..How do I get those cute little pictures next to my comment?
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January 27th, 2009 at 2:30 pm
Very good example Geoff however I wonder if Davis (recruited nearly 10 years ago) would still get recruited today though. Even Brisbane who has a history of carrying players (Brown, Breanan and Hooper) would rather pick up a kid who was in the best 80 – 100 players recruited than Davis who could play senior football next year.
I do agree that teams back their culture to sort out players attitude but in looking at a number of rejects that were traded/ delisted/ moved on etc. Majority of them had issues with Cousins, Hislop, Carroll and Davis. Point taken however that they do not have an once of talent compared to Gary Ablett snr.
Thanks for your comment Geoff, long time no see…
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February 3rd, 2009 at 6:15 pm
i think what happens when you have players as special as Ablett and Lockett etc, is that team mates become too focused on them. it becomes almost a one man team. Dunstall had good forwards around him, Carey had good forwards around him,Ablett although he had Brownless for a while was generally forced to kick the Cats home and in tight finals football you cannot rely on one person to win a game for you. The special thing about Ablett is that he nearly did in’89. i think he would easily get a game with most teams. i’d have him at the Dogs
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February 4th, 2009 at 8:19 am
Carey had good forwards?? Longmuire played one or two good seasons but he could easily have been a 100+ goal kicker for a few seasons if played for another club. I always thought that was Norths problem that they relied too much on Carey like Geelong with Ablett.
It was the case. Ablett snr and Lockett were carried through many pre seasons etc. As a kid one of my coaches who was on the Saints list told us how Lockett used to get picked up at the start of the cross country run and then dropped off near the end. It is no wonder St Kilda/ Sydney and Geelong never won a Grand Final with them in their teams. You cannot afford to carry anyone….
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February 4th, 2009 at 5:32 pm
The kangas had some very good forwards, don’t forget that McKernan topped the Brownlow count in ’96. Craig Sholl was brilliant at playing the decoy forward, Abraham, Allison and Harvey were great crumbers as well. The brilliant thing that Pagan did was give Carey plenty of space to always be in a one on one position. The Cats were a better team in ’91/’92 when Ablett played on the flank. He was still able to kick bags of goals but had Brownless, Stoneham etc, as the lead up targets. From ’93 onwards he was forced to do too much and the Cats suffered greatly for it.
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February 5th, 2009 at 10:17 am
The forwards you mention Deano were very good foils but when ever did they kick bags of goals when Carey was having a day off? Longmuire did but Sholl, Abraham, Allison and Harvey rarely did.
What I like about the Hawthorn side is that when Franklin is down either Roughead, Williams, Rilio, Hodge and Brown can kick a bag.
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February 6th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
that is the whole argument mate, the kangas had good forwards who did their job and collectively the whole forward unit was effective enough to contribute to them winning 2 flags. Just like the Hawks last year and the Cats the year before.
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February 9th, 2009 at 7:36 am
Do you think they should have won more than 2 Grand Finals though? What if they had some forwards who could have kicked a few more bags and could that have helped them win at least one or two more Grand Finals?
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February 9th, 2009 at 7:49 am
Jermayn, you’d be kidding. Who complains about winning 2 Grand finals in a decade? With the exception of Carey, the Kangaroos were a very even, average side who were lucky enough not to come up against a dominant outfit in the years they won flags (or have Carlton knock one out in the preliminary). As a Tigers supporter who will be over the moon if we sneak more than one final this year – even talking about that borders on being offensive
Geoffs last blog post..To any international readers, a prayer request
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February 9th, 2009 at 9:03 am
I think you will be surprised about the Tigers this year Geoff…
In regards to North not winning more than two premierships, I am not kidding. If they had a descent forward, they could have won the 98 Grand Final and not been kicked out of race the game before the Grand Final…
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May 22nd, 2009 at 10:25 am
of course he would get a game.he would be made to train in todays game and this would result in him kicking probably 200 goals a year instead of only 100.the guy would have to be the most naturally gifted athlete of all time, and i dont even follow geelong.he would simply be picked up cause of talent alone, then made to do the hard work
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June 7th, 2009 at 2:15 pm
Why don’t forwards kick double figure bags any more.I understand defensive tactics have evolved remarkably ,but isn’t this counteracted by stricter umpiring.In the old days back could scrag,hold,punch and get away with it ,these days they cannot even touch the forward.
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June 8th, 2009 at 10:20 am
I do not think it is the umpires or better defensive tactics but more the fact that:
1) Todays forwards are not as good as yesterdays Dunstalls/ Locketts/ Abletts/ Colemans/ Pratts etc
2) The Full Forward position is almost a forgoteen position with todays zones etc
Hope this helps answers your question Steve!
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June 8th, 2009 at 11:12 am
Or Peter Hudson one of the best ever who is often overlooked
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June 8th, 2009 at 11:18 am
I was trying to think of his name.
You also have Wade (kicked over 1000)..
I am in the middle of getting some thoughts from the other Kick2Kick team and we will try and give a bigger and longer balanced POV.
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June 8th, 2009 at 11:47 am
I cannot believe that today’s forwards are not as good as yesteryears.There are brilliant players in all eras but the double figure bags stopped about 10 years ago after being around for many,many decades.There must be another reason such as defensive zones don’t allow the ball to be delivered as it was or some other reason
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June 8th, 2009 at 11:51 am
Full Forwards are better these days, more defensive more committed however yes the zone has reduced the easy leading marks and rotation prevents full game time and because of there defensive work often are forced out of the goal square to help out so imo there is less delivery one on one, and i bet you will see that midfielders today kick many more goals than midfielders of previous years.
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June 8th, 2009 at 11:52 am
Part of it is that it didn’t happen as regularly as you seem to remember, and it’s not like it hasn’t happened in the last few years either. The other part is that team structures have changed, and players tend to drop back and give the full back a hand with the tall marking forward. Plus midfielders score a lot more than they used to.
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July 12th, 2009 at 8:16 am
Are you kidding?
Why do you think his son plays the way he does? Because he watched his dad ,and his dad was the sh$@.He had the balance ,strength,pace and talent.He could use his body like no one could and no one does these days except jnr.I think Nathan could be great too ,if he put his mind to it because he has the talent of his dad . I watched gary ablett snr so carefully whenever I watched a geelong game (cats supporter)and when i got on the footy field my mates said I played like him.
Legend , legend , legend . Your question is understanding but to me it’s one of the silliest questions i’ve heard. Garry Ablett you are still my hero.
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September 17th, 2009 at 11:59 am
U blokes are all in the head…. Hes the greatest ever and wouldnt matter what era he plays in!
Is funny how the internet makes people think that everyone gives a shit about there opinion…No one does losers so shut the hell up and go back to thinking you are experts in your own little world and spare the rest of us from your pathetic thoughts!
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September 17th, 2009 at 12:06 pm
@Jaso – We do not claim to be experts, well maybe in our own lunchboxes, but this is just a bunch of fans who get together, argue and discuss stuff. This article was one example where we just raised a question and let people express what they think.
But let me say this, it takes more than you to call us a loser for us to stop writing what we think…
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October 17th, 2009 at 5:56 pm
this is the worst question i have ever herd and shows you have dead set zero brains about football. ablett had the most individul skill than any player to ever play the game.. hands down no one could produce some of the things ablett did on the footy feild and still even today no player come close to him.. tell me who kicks 9 goals in a loosing gf?? and almost one the game of his own boot.. just look at ablett jnr and you will find your answer.. not taking anything from ablett jnr but he aint an asshole of wat ablett snr was as a player.. and about ablett snr being the worst trainer when your that good you dont have to train hard.. u r a dick 4 even thinking he wouldent make it in todays game.. he would dominate more cause todays game is so soft compard to wen he was playing
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October 18th, 2009 at 1:13 pm
Rhys Grieve (above) is right.
The fact that you guys are even asking the question you are asking, tells us automatically that the answer is “YES!”. He’d run rings around the boring players of today.
It was once said of Elvis by I think one of the Rolling Stones or similar, that “he had moves no-one else had”. That was clear: Elvis on stage moved differently than anyone else.
Ablett was the Elvis of AFL.
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October 19th, 2009 at 7:35 am
You guys are missing the point, I am not saying Gary Ablett is not the Elvis of football or the best there ever was (and would run rings around his son).
What I am suggesting is would a team take a risk on an individual with baggage like Ablett snr. Would they recruit him and put up with his antics?
I know Fevola would not be worthy to carry his hat (and he does wear some nice hats) but both snr and Fevola carried on off and on field. Carlton gave up on Fev, would a club be able to curve his attitude?
Personally I doubt it..
btw thanks guys for discussing this and yes we do know a lot about football hence why we talk about it, so you do not need to question our knowledge just because we ask something a little different
Jermayn´s last blog ..AFL Quiz 4
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November 11th, 2009 at 9:37 am
Most of Ablett”s antics were before he got to Geelong weren’t they? i heard he was a wild one when he was younger. He definately didn’t make a dick of himself like fevolva has. On the field, he attacked the ball so hard that at times he smashed someone to high (2 or 3 suspensions maybe)? i wouldn’t say he had too many on field antics.
a ” bad trainer” you say ? Maybe you can remember when he was in his later years. Geelong rested him when he was in his mid 30′s because he was so important .He played until he was about 35 I think. Oldest player to kick 100 goals in a season (33 years old in 1995)
Geelong was a very good team who made many Grand finals when Ablett was there. They didn’t win any , but don’t forget that they were there(GF) and to make that the superbowl, world cup final or the Granny it takes a good team to get there.
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November 16th, 2009 at 9:48 am
@Stu – You ever watch him?? I will admit I only saw his later years but I have heard plenty from ex players/ teammates and ex coaches.
- Suspensions where not collecting someone high in a contest, it was a whack or two.
- On Field Antics – His only antics was being too good…
- Did Geelong rest him? I know he retired and came back mid season but did not know about his ‘resting’.
- The comment about his training came from an interview over here in the West from ex teammate and roommate (on away games) Buddha Hocking, I have also heard other comments but this came from someone who was close to him.
There is no denying his talent and its a pity he did not get that premiership glory (except the years 92 & 94) but he was no God, he had his demons on field just as much as off field after retirement.
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May 9th, 2010 at 7:25 pm
You could also ask the question; would any of todays stars get a game back then?
Or would they all be a little too ‘soft’..???
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